Reefton Jack

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Posts by Reefton Jack

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  26

  is it just me or do mormons look happier than jdubs?

  by in a new york bethel minute in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  it seems to me that mormons enjoy their work a lot more than jdubs... and they do it 12 hours a day.

  they have to walk everywhere.

  they have no social life or money.

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  Reefton Jack

  The Mormon "Missionaries" of the door-to-door variety do seem to be happier than "Jehovahs Happy People."

  However, it is rather difficult to compare the two:

  - I am happy to be corrected if I am wrong, but I understand that Mormon Missionaries are engaged as such for two years only. Before that and after that, there is no requirement to hand in a "Monthly Report" - or else receive the pineapple if you don't, as is the case with the JWs.

  It is easier to appear to enjoy your work if you know the task is of only two years duration - versus dragging on forever, with somebody standing over you at all times with a big stick (with or without a carrot on the end labelled 1914,1925, 1975, 1984 and whatever BS the WTS come sup with next!)

  Jack
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  45

  Anybody here who still has faith in God and belief in the Bible?

  by Sheepish in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  there seems to be a lot of folks here who are bitter and want nothing to do with organized religion (understandable!

  ) or the belief in a god who cares about us, and has a "plan".or even anyone who has actually read and studied the bible, and understands what's going on it it.

  so many just take stuff out of context looking for "mistakes" and loopholes.

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  Reefton Jack

  Mention has been made of persons "throwing the baby out with the bathwater" when they broke with the JWs.

  For many of us, after we discarded the dirty, WTS polluted water; we then found out that their was no baby there in the first place!

  Further to that, the inference that if you do not believe in God / the bible then you are automatically unpricipled is incorrect:

  - Ethics/ Morals are a totally separate issue to religion.

  Jack
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  7

  Do you know of any "born-again christians" that became JW's?

  by booker-t in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was just wondering how many born-agains become jw's especially the ones that know all about the wt history of false prophecies, scandals, etc; and what do they say now if they might have told you about the errors of the wt.

  do they suddenly get amnesia?

  i remember when i was in high school in the 1980's there was a girl that used to try and convert me to born-againism.

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  Reefton Jack

  I knew of two such persons, whom at one point had considered themselves to be "born again."

  How strong these two may have been in their convictions, though, could have been a different story! It would seem that this term "born again" can be very loosely applied - anyone can call themselvesborn again.

  Jack.
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  26

  Were the "Pioneers" in your hall treated with favoritism by the Elders?

  by booker-t in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it seems that all of the parts on the theocratic ministry school were given by the pioneers in my old hall.

  also the elders were always complemented on how "sister pioneer" is so zealous and loves jehovah.

  as if sister not pioneering hated jehovah.

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  Reefton Jack

  Different writers on this board have commented on how a noticeable "Caste System" works in the congregations.

  Within this caste system, pioneers rate highly.

  In all the congregations that I was in, being a pioneer got you fast tracked to being appointed an MS or an elder.

  Jack.
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  13

  Mankind doesn't have the ability to govern himself, true or false?

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  jeremiah 10:23.

  23 i well know, o jehovah, that to earthling man his way does not belong.

  it does not belong to man who is walking even to direct his step.

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  Reefton Jack

  Whether this is true or false is immaterial:

  -The fact is, we have to govern ourselves, as no other #^!$%^d will!

  Jack.
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  23

  Subliminal messages and the "nodding off" mind

  by Lady Lee in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  ok i know there are all kinds of educational tapes you can get to help you learn better and faster.

  many of them are tapes you put on and then go to sleep.

  the rationale is that it is easier to learn while you are sleeping.

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  Reefton Jack

  The mind consists of two parts:

  - The Conscious Mind; that learns only by making a conscious effort to do so.

  - The Sub-conscious Mind; that by its very definition absorbs information "subconsciously" i.e. without a person necessarily being aware of it.

  The subconscious mind may be more highly developed in some people than in others. (Probably why some have tried subliminal learning techniques - met with little success - and so consequently labelled it all "bunkum").

  T

  he conscious mind can only stay focused on one subject for, on average about 20 minutes.

  Contrast that with a JW Assembly/Convention that drones on for days, and there is plenty of scope for the sub-conscious mind to, as Minimus expressed ,"hear everything and evaluate nothing."

  While most JWs are at a loss to defend the "deep" points of JW doctrine:

  (how can you defend / explain BS, that even its architects are not sure about, anyway?)

  - a mind numbing environment can be used as one (out of an arsenal of many) of the underhanded techniques to manipulate an audience.

  - to gain their accepting without question what is being presented.

  Whether by accident or design, boring an audience to death over a prolonged period of time is an effective way of both:

  1) Switching off the Conscious Mind (everyone is "miles away" after 20 minutes).

  2) Leaving them open to subliminal influences, being picked up by the Sub-Conscious Mind.

  "Freedom to choose" works only on a level playing field.

  This idea of a "Level Playing Field" may not quite be a mythological creature - but it is certainly on the Endangered Species list!

  Jack.

  PS: The fact that part of the mind, also, works automatically is not exactly unique. Our respiratory system also works automatically:

  - We don't make a conscious effort to firstly draw in, then to exhale each breath. That doesn't mean that it is not happening, though.
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  49

  Has the exodus begun now?

  by toby888 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  anyone have any real information if the great exodus has begun?

  tickle my ears-

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  Reefton Jack

  There has nearly always been an exodus - proven by a simple count.

  Take the previous year's total average publishers and add the current year's total number baptised:

  - Compare this Grand Total with the actual average number of publishers for the current year.

  - The current year's average is nearly always a lot less than the number of baptisms added to the previous year's average.

  In fact, it always used to be roughly on the scale of for every two persons "coming in", there was one who "went out."

  This ratio applied even in countries where there had been a noticeable increase in publishers.

  The only time there was an exception to this was during the mid-1980s , when the WTS mounted a campaign to re-activate those who once might have "active publishers" ect.

  I haven't seen the latest statistics (better things to do with my time!), but by all reports, these would look bad!

  Jack.
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  23

  Subliminal messages and the "nodding off" mind

  by Lady Lee in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  ok i know there are all kinds of educational tapes you can get to help you learn better and faster.

  many of them are tapes you put on and then go to sleep.

  the rationale is that it is easier to learn while you are sleeping.

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  Reefton Jack

  Thank you, Ingenuous, for those inputs.

  After finally waking up to the fact that JW doctrine was all BS, I went through a period of intense self-disgust that I had fallen for it for so long.

  However, after learning of these facts about the JW indoctrination process, I got over that.

  Given the subtle, low level hypnotic effects brought about by the WTS teaching processes, how much "freedom of choice" did we really have?

  Some writers on this board claim that we were, in effect, "all JWs by choice."

  When defending my faith (usually at the doors), I can recall more than once asserting "If I thought there was anything wrong with my religion, I would leave it!" However, we may not have had the freedom of choice that we thought we did.

  More like, as my late father used to say, we had " The freedom to do as you are told."

  Jack
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  24

  While preaching, did you realize that you were also screwing up their lives

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  .

  when you were going door to door, although you had the pure intention of teaching people what you taught was god's will, did you realize back then, that if they listened to you and accepted a bible study that you were also screwing up their lives and that they would suffer greatly by this?.

  it was always in back of my mind.....

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  Reefton Jack

  No - I honestly thought that I was doing the right thing.

  I believed that their reaction to the preaching work was a life and death matter.

  Yes, I had swallowed the WTS crap hook, line and sinker!

  Jack.
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  37

  What religions did you seek since leaving? Or not?

  by dezpbem in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm curious how many people on the board have looked into other religions or spirituality groups since they've left the jw.. what have you looked into?

  did you join anything else?

  read up on any others?

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  Reefton Jack

  Very definitely none at all!

  Some writers on this board have claimed that "people need religion."

  All I can say is - I sure as anything you like don't (A conclusion that I have formed after both my own experiences while a JW, and my own observations of those in other religions).

  Jack